Interview with Awo Fa'lokun & Iya Aina Olomo, Oloriya Leja Ile Olokun Sanya Awo Peju.
Awo Fa'lokun: Tell us about your involvement with Orisa.
Iya Aina: In my mid-twenties I was introduced to the Orisa in the Bronx and started practicing Lucumi.
Awo Fa'lokun: And you went on to become initiated.
Iya Aina: Yes, I was as a devotee for ten or twelve years then I was initiated to Sango in 1982.
Awo Fa'lokun: Since then you have formed ile's in various parts of the world.
Iya Aina: Yes, I spent my Iyawo year in Texas and worked as a spiritualist with the Curandera community and learned quite a bit from them on the day-to-day level of plants and herbs, and cleanings and basic rituals that assist people with every day issues. I started working with my first spiritual students in Texas when I was probably a two years old priestess. When I my initiation was about three or four I was sent by my Orisa to Miami Florida so that I could learn more about my tradition. South Florida has a large population that follows various forms of Yoruba spiritual traditions. I moved there so that I could be in a broader more active community and learn more about the tradition.
Awo Fa'lokun: While you were there did you take part in some significant legal matters?
Iya Aina: I spent a short time working with Ernesto Pinchardo who was doing some classes with the local police departments to culturally sensitize the officers. His goal was for the officers not to disrespect the homes and religious objects of people who practice Lucumi. So they would not over react to things they saw. I also did some work with Willie Ramos when he was organizing Cabildos. Cabildos are egbes or societies of priests that work together for specific reasons. He was quite forward in his thinking. He was trying to give priests who work with the Orisa full time access to up group health insurance; he developed a newsletter, and set up methods for the egbe to make cooperative purchases. The goal was to make things more economical.
I spent a decade in Florida. During that time the Orisa decided to use me to start a cultural center to bring indigenous performance arts into the community and school system of Fort Lauderdale. Because there was only one festival in the area at the time that had anything to do with ethnic arts and there really wasn't any cultural centers or theater or visual arts that had anything to do with anyone of color, not just the African-Americans. This was really quite sad considering the ethnic diversity of south Florida. I am told that the entity has now African-American and Caribbean resource library.
Awo Fa'lokun: You spent some time in Trinidad?
Iya Aina: Yes, I went to Trinidad to study and learn more about Sango because in my heart I believe the Orisa community of Trinidad truly has a spiritual bond with Sango that is, that goes way beyond anything I had previously learned in this country. I am grateful for their hospitality and everything I learned during the years I lived there.
Awo Fa'lokun: Recently you received Iyaami Osoronga.
Iya Aina: Yes I did.
Awo Fa'lokun: There seems to be a lot of disagreement over the function of Iyaami within our community. What is your understanding of the spiritual essence of Iyaami Osoronga?
Iya Aina: Well, I believe we all have a sexual soul. That the collective entity absorbs the souls of the evolved spiritually evolved when they die. The sexual soul then becomes part of the collective entity. This female collective entity is Iyaami.
Awo Fa'lokun: By sexual do you mean gender?
Iya Aina: Yes. If I have am female if or rather when I have developed to that point that my soul will join the Iyaami's. (my mothers)
Awo Fa'lokun: What is the function of that collective soul in our religious practice?
Iya Aina: To me that collective consciousness has all the wisdom, the rage, the fears, the knowledge of everything ever experienced by women. This include either by the hands of men, or children or society. If one wants to gain an in depth understanding of one's life one needs to be able to connect with that sexual aspect of themselves.
Awo Fa'lokun: What is the connection between the women's gender soul and the imagery of birds?
Iya Aina: Well the birds assimilate power and flight. To be able to fly and to be able to manifest things and do things that are beyond the ordinary capability of the two legged people.
Awo Fa'lokun: Do see an association between the imagery of birds and the ability of elder mothers to astral travel?
Iya Aina: Well of course we can astral travel which is probably where they got the idea of the witches on the broom stick because we can be here, we can be there, we can be anywhere. Actually we are a personality type anyway.
Awo Fa'lokun: What do you mean by that?
Iya Aina: Women who have extra spiritual ability, power or ase probably have connection in some way or another to the Iyaami. Sometimes what they think is their ancestral spirit working for them is really an Iyaami who is providing assistance or giving answers or manifesting things that they ask for.
Awo Fa'lokun: Do have any thoughts about why initiation into Iyaami is not common in the Diaspora?
Iya Aina: Well yes, we have a European mindset and our society is modeled after Europe and Europe has a fear over women and their power. We kind of adopted that same mindset and have superimposed it on our own belief system. So we suppress women even in Ifa because we don't want women to think that there is anything particularly for them.
Awo Fa'lokun: Do you think there is balance between Ifa and Iyaami in the Orisa communities in this country?
Iya Aina: No. Where Ifa, Orunmila has been, for the most part an exclusively male domain, there has not been a corresponding spot within our structure where women are acknowledged for their contribution to Nature. From a metaphysical point of view there is no recognition of what women contribute.
Awo Fa'lokun: Do you see that reflected in part of the debate over whether or not women receive Odu as part of the Ifa initiation?
Iya Aina: Well I think that Odu is an issue that is currently blown out of proportion. It is being discussed from the stand point that it is something that is prohibited to the female gender even though they can go on to have initiations as Iyanifa they are still prohibited to view, or work with or have Odu. But Odu has not been explained that it is all about femaleness which is something that the women already have which is why they don't need to receive it because it is an ase of power that they already have. It is something they have been given in Nature.
Awo Fa'lokun: As a birthright?
Iya Aina: Yes.
Awo Fa'lokun: What is the effect of that debate on the community?
Iya Aina: The effect is that once again women are being told that we are excluded from something because of our gender and that is not necessarily true, we are being excluded because we don't need it. There hasn't been any discussion about how Iyaami and Odu fit together. Instead Iyaami has been put in the same paragraph with Odu as being something we should avoid and as something we don't need to know about and both are our female powers.
Awo Fa'lokun: The Odu Irete Ogbe says the women of Iyaami gave Orunmila Odu to assist him in his work. I find it interesting that the verse that refers to this is excluded from virtually all the English translations of the Ifa oracle. I hear you saying the men are making the rules on how women can relate to their own power.
Iya Aina: They are restricting our access to them; they are controlling access to them. I mean they have alienated us from our own power.
Awo Fa'lokun: So what do you see as the road towards rectifying this situation?
Iya Aina: That we begin to explore the metaphysical principals involved with balance and realize that yes Orunmila is where Orunmila is, but what is the balance to that? If the balance is Iyaami then I would like to see those who have information and can teach and share with the women do that.
Awo Fa'lokun: So do you think there is a component of education around developing a deeper understanding of the metaphysical principals that we are trying to reflect in our practice and discipline?
Iya Aina: Part of the teaching methodology that creates an opportunity for patriarchal behavior is not teaching the metaphysical principal of balance in our tradition we are leaning towards a one deity approach as opposed to a harmonious and balanced nature way of believing and practicing.
Awo Fa'lokun: Can you talk about the relationship between Iyaami and Aje?
Iya Aina: Aje is one of the manifestation of Iyaami and it manifests as a personality type within the population. These personality types typically will have psychic powers or spiritual powers and abilities that are not common. The Aje will have more than one ori inu (inner self). It will have two or as many as seven that give them access to spiritual power that will allow them to more easily manifest things. They have these extra portions to themselves. In other words they have access to portions of their brain that other people don't have. It is part of the human evolution. The Aje personality types will have power that is very apparent to the rest of us and they may or may not be aware that they have evolved to be Aje. If they are aware of it they won't acknowledge it verbally simply because of all the negative stigmas attached to Aje and Iyaami.
Awo Fa'lokun: When you say the ori inu, the inner self, do you think there are different portions of the brain that give us easier access to other dimensions of reality?
Iya Aina: Yes.
Awo Fa'lokun: Are you saying everyone has those latent abilities but not everyone is able to access and activate them?
Iya Aina: Right. In your brain you have it there as an organ, but having it function is something that is predetermined by ori when it chooses its destiny. Not everyone was evolved enough to actually choose that. The Aje are very highly developed entities so they had that on their menu of options when coming here. Sometimes the Aje as an aspect of Iyaami can disguise their abilities and it is more comfortable for them to disguise their abilities and have them appear to manifest as Orisa given powers, or ancestral given powers when actually it is a power that is their own. It is an Aje, but because they don't always understand it as that sometimes the Aje among us contribute their power to Orisa, Egun and other spirits.
Awo Fa'lokun: Is the ability of Aje the ability to build a stronger link with other spirits?
Iya Aina: Well the Aje is a separate entity and it co-exists with all the others, but it has not gotten the attention or the understanding of the others. The strength we have as humans is limited because we have not activated it as a collective. It takes activation and feeding to give it strength.
Awo Fa'lokun: What is your view of the African perspective on this?
Iya Aina: Well I think it is basically the same thing. They have had European colonialization as well and I think that some of the fear of the Iyaami comes from Christianity as well as Islam.
Awo Fa'lokun: What is your understanding of the metaphysics of the phenomena?
Iya Aina: Well, metaphysically speaking everything in our tradition is balanced and so if you have a male who has a significant ability to change things and affect the material world then you would have to have a female who could do the same thing.
Awo Fa'lokun: What was your personal experience of receiving Iyaami?
Iya Aina: It felt like being embraced by the combined energy of my grandmothers, my mothers, my sisters, a coming home. I have reached an energy field where my emotional and physical make-up is understood and appreciated.
Awo Fa'lokun: What do you see as the role of Iyaami in your personal life?
Iya Aina: In my personal life the Iyaami are always there to provide guidance, to repair my self-esteem that has been damaged by some of the experiences I have had from those who our traditions from a patriarchal perspective. The mothers feel like they are primal, primordial, some people don't like that word primal, but primordial in their essence beyond the constraints of contemporary society, space and time. Their energy, to me probably began to consolidate with the first scream of a woman in pain, the first tears that were shed from heartbreak and or abuse. The birds are their symbol and often their disguise. These mystical birds move forward and backwards in time and crosses dimensions to bring information back that can help my community. They can carry my spirit with them to share and show me many things.
Awo Fa'lokun: What role does Iyaami play in your ile?
Iya Aina: Iyaami makes sure the women have solid self esteem and access to a collective power that is women's. Working with Iyaami helps women to develop or nurture a strong sense of themselves getting rid of ideas that a female may be somehow less than or weaker spiritually than a male. We are being taught that gender roles are balanced and equal. Each has specific and distinct functions. There is no reason to think that because you are a female you are lesser or that anything less is expected of you simply because you happen to be of a certain gender.
Awo Fa'lokun: What do you see as the relationship between Iyaami and Ifa?
Iya Aina: Well, I think you need the both of them in order to mirror natural and cosmic balance
.
Awo Fa'lokun: Do you see them as having an important working relationship?
Iya Aina: Absolutely, the Iyaami help Ifa be effectual and Ifa uses works with the Mothers. They work together. Oracle states that Orunmila made the ebo (sacrifice) and that created an agreement between them. The Mothers are the cosmic cops. The mothers know if the intention of your work and deeds are in tune with what is ethically and morally correct. Since they know your heart they can know what you are trying to do and undo it because it wasn't done with the proper intention. I think this may be one of the reasons many of us were taught to always offer a portion of any major ritual foods to the Iyami.
Awo Fa'lokun: What relationship do they have with the traditional Yoruba kings if they behave improperly?
Iya Aina: The Iyaami have been known to take life and disrupt even the reign of kings. To me it symbolizes the alignment of the king's crown, which is his power with cosmic justice and the support his status can enjoy from the Iyaami. Even a king has to be mindful of the birds of Iyaami's power.
Awo Fa'lokun: Do you see a trend to be more inclusive or exclusive in our community?
Iya Aina: I think our community is going through some transcendent changes. Right now ritual-things and perspectives seem to be rather chaotic, but I think as more of the women, who practice various strains of our tradition age the more guidance they will receive directly from Iyami. We are gaining a better understanding of who we are and familiarizing ourselves with our source of power as women. I think it is ironic that two entities that pertains to female power specifically has been labored unavailable to women or a force that has been characterized as 'evil, wicked or destructive." Instead being explained that in the case of Odu not being able to be viewed by women that it is not necessary because females are already in touch with their feminine side by virtue of their birth rite. Iyaami is all about the power and force exerted by the primal energy of women and that has been something we have been taught to fear.
Awo Fa'lokun: Do you see any consequences for the increased emphasis on Ifa in our community over the past ten years?
Iya Aina: Well yes, I think we are moving towards making Orunmila the prophet, the Christ, the Buddha, the monk, the Mohammad of Ifa and I don't think that is quite what our ancestors or Nature has in mind. Everything in our tradition is balanced, Nature is balanced, winter time, summer time, male, female, daytime, nighttime, Orunmila and Iyami it's that simple. I think females should try to discover how their energy assists Ifa instead of trying to become Orunmila, or debating what women can or cannot experience during an initiation to Ifa. But to address your question in general, the real problem is when you are studying, as many of us are trying to do, none of these new books on Ifa talk about the priesthood of any of the other Orisa. The current trend is to focus on one deity and use this approach to our spirituality. To me this seems to mean if the trend continues in that vein soon everyone is going to be initiated only to Orunmila, men, women, and children. What happens to the mysteries and the awo of the rest of the divinities? Maybe they will pass away and our tradition will bear little difference from other religions that support a single divinity. We will have a book, and we will have a prophet and we will be just like everyone else.
Awo Fa'lokun: What do you see as the value of spiritual diversity in our discipline?
Iya Aina: Our tradition isn't for everybody.
Awo Fa'lokun: No, I meant within the community. Is it important to have Sango worshippers and not just Orunmila worshippers?
Iya Aina: I worship Nature. Okay, look you need somebody to know about Yemoja if she is drowning your children. Someone has to be able to talk to her and understand her movements and her temperaments and how she moves and all her mysteries. We especially must not forget how to propitiate or activate the power of the divinities. We can't do away with the specialists or the human manifestation of Orisa. We can't. Everything in Nature is balanced, everything. In order to know all that we need to know to live in this eco-system we need to be connected with the rain, the wind, the salt water, the volcano, the forests, the thunder the lightning. We need to know as much as we can about all that we worship.
Awo Fa'lokun: Having people who are specialists gives the community a greater possibility of balance rather than having everyone be a generalist.
Iya Aina: Absolutely. Yes, I mean you can't just have everyone initiated to Orunmila and that's enough. It does not reflect the cooperative essence of nature. There is more to our tradition than divination. I don't believe Orunmila even wants to be all alone. He doesn't want imbalance. That is where we seem to be headed now. For Orunmila to say okay now you need to make an ebo to Sango and when there is no Sango priest anywhere to tell you how to best activate that divinity. That could present a problem for Orunmila who is ultimately going to have to work that one out, including the destinies of all those that had chosen to connect to a specific divinity. I feel like spiritual dinosaurs, like myself, believe if we continue in this vain we will only have one divinity and it will be Orunmila and when we want to feed the other divinities we will just feed the ground and that's it. And hope for the best. All rituals will focus on propitiation, calming their anger, feeding the ground and that's it, but what about their worship? What about all the mysteries, all the secrets, and all the things they teach us about surviving on this planet by being connected to their energy? Nature is like an orchestra, there are some of us who have to be a violin, a harp, a guitar, a piano, and a trumpet and when played together there is the possibility for that we can make a symphony. You cannot take a solo and continue to play it, over and over again before the instrument is broken. It is not Nature it is not natural.
Awo Fa'lokun: I understand you have plans to teach and do workshops in the upcoming year, is that correct.
Iya Aina: I am quite reclusive; However, I am a servant and when I can be a genuine servant I don't mind rolling up my sleeves and working.
